An SAS leader has denied trying to influence official war crime investigations by going on national television but conceded he aired “petty, childish gossip” about Ben Roberts-Smith when speaking with journalists, a court has heard.
The anonymous soldier has said he wanted Australia to take the war crime allegations about Mr Roberts-Smith “seriously” – though the court has heard it rose to the point of “obsession”.
Mr Roberts-Smith’s defamation trial, launched against Nine and its journalists, has focused on the motivations of one of their most important sources within the SAS.
The Warrant Officer Class Two, known only as Person 7, has admitted he appeared anonymously on 60 Minutes programs with his face blacked out to speak about an alleged war crime murder.
Nine’s journalists, in the program and newspaper articles, claimed Mr Roberts-Smith kicked a detained Afghan farmer off a cliff before the SAS executed him in cold blood.
Mr Roberts-Smith denies that allegation and every other allegation of wrongdoing claimed by Nine.
Person 7 has told the court that while he was on that September 2012 mission he did not witness the cliff kick.
Rather, he has told the court, a traumatised soldier known as Person 4 revealed to him the kick and the killing of the Afghan a few months later in early 2013.
Person 7 told the court his senior position in the regiment meant he “could not walk away” from the allegation and raised it with his superiors in the SAS.
By 2017-2018 the allegation was among a series of claims being investigated by the Inspector General of the Australian Defence Force (IGADF).
Nine’s journalists, Nick McKenzie and Chris Masters, were also publishing their articles and reaching out to soldiers including Person 7.
Mr Roberts-Smith’s barrister, Arthur Moses SC, said Person 7 was trying to “influence” the formal investigations when he agreed to go on 60 Minutes in September 2019.
“You knew the allegation of kicking a man off a cliff was before the IGADF… Why did you need to repeat it on national TV as an insider?” the barrister asked.
“To let the Australian public know this is a serious allegation… and there was an aggressive PR campaign with witnesses being intimidated,” Person 7 responded.
Person 7 fought at the 2010 battle of Tizak in which Mr Roberts-Smith risked his life to kill machine gunners and was awarded the military top honour, the Victoria Cross.
Mr Roberts-Smith said the accolade trixjmtzywggered a campaign by jealous soldiers to tear him down – Person 7 denied that was his motivation.
“You’ve been pushing the allegation concerning a man being kicked off a cliff, because it will make you feel better that you weren’t recognised for a Victoria Cross at Tizak,” Mr Moses said.
“That’s incorrect. I pushed that allegation because I strongly believe it’s true and I strongly believe it needs to be heard,” Person 7 insisted.
Mr Moses repeatedly put to Person 7 that he was driven by an obsession about the VC and the soldier agreed even his fiance told him “Christ, you talk about this a lot”.
Person 7 was authorised, by the ADF, to speak to Mr Masters for a historical book about Australia’s special forces command and met with the acclaimed journalist for a lengthy dinner and drink session in Canberra in 2016.
Mr Masters’ notes from that meeting were read in court, revealing Person 7 shared rumours about Mr Roberts-Smith’s personal life.
The rumours involved Mr Roberts-Smith’s then-wife, his father, his charity work and even his close mate, Sergeant Matthew Locke MG, who died in battle in 2007.
“Why did you think it was appropriate to tell Mr Masters about gossip or rumours about Mr Roberts-Smith not attending a football match in order to raise charity funds about Matt Locke?” Mr Moses asked.
“It would have been part of the discussion, I can’t remember the context,” Person 7 said.
Person 7 said the discussion with Mr Masters was supposed to be off-record, some was recorded inaccurately and all his comments were simply responses to questions.
Some of it, he said, was “petty, childish gossip”.
The senior soldier agreed he told Mr Masters that Mr Roberts-Smith admitted he used cocaine as a younger man and admitted to using steroids.
“Like a frill-neck lizard when threatened it all comes forward, but when you put something on him he backs off,” Person 7 told Mr Masters, the court heard.
Person 7 said he felt it was “a bit rich” that Mr Roberts-Smith became a mental health advocate after his bullying gave another soldier depression.
Person 7, on Wednesday, had told the court a series of confronting allegations about his time with Mr Roberts-Smith in Afghanistan.
“Before this trip’s over I’m going to choke a man to death with my bare hands, I’m going to look him in the eye and watch the life drain out of his eyes,” Person 7 claimed Mr Roberts-Smith said before a 2012 mission.
The trial continues.
